2 IN 1 SHOWCASE EPISODE 74: MARK MILLAR AND WANTED

[Blake Petit]

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Episode 74: Mark Millar and Wanted
by Chase Bouzigard and Blake Petit

With Wanted coming soon to a theater near you, Chase and Blake take the time to discuss the works of writer Mark Millar. Chase is a fan, Blake not so much, but the guys do their best to get to the heart of his work, discuss the Wanted comic book, and talk about their expectations for the movie. In ths picks this week, Blake loves the first few weeks of Trinity, while Chase enjoyed the beginning of Ultimate Origins... then, stay tuned, as each of the guys has a special announcement! E-mail us with your comments, "Ask Chase Anything" questions, or anything else at Showcase@comixtreme.com!


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Episode 74: Mark Millar and Wanted

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[Wolverace]

I am so going to love this episode. Downloading now.

[Wolverace]

For Chase's guerilla comic collecting:

Wolverine, Fantastic Four, 1985.
Seriously, I feel for you. I've had to cut down too two years ago, when my wife and I bought a house (those prices are crazy these days), and I've trimmed down to roughly 8 titles a month and the cheap trades from amazon (well, on amazon, they all get cheap after a few months). So, I can relate in a way. But in a way, you get more enjoyment from your titles.

The episode was very constrained imo. But very little on Wanted. I was surprised you guys didn't enjoy the title. I loved it. There is shockvalue, but it is done so tongue in cheek and it has so many double entendres it's really an awesome title.

[Blake Petit]

Originally Posted by Wolverace

For Chase's guerilla comic collecting:

Wolverine, Fantastic Four, 1985.
Seriously, I feel for you. I've had to cut down too two years ago, when my wife and I bought a house (those prices are crazy these days), and I've trimmed down to roughly 8 titles a month and the cheap trades from amazon (well, on amazon, they all get cheap after a few months). So, I can relate in a way. But in a way, you get more enjoyment from your titles.

The episode was very constrained imo. But very little on Wanted. I was surprised you guys didn't enjoy the title. I loved it. There is shockvalue, but it is done so tongue in cheek and it has so many double entendres it's really an awesome title.

Be honest here -- were you just surprised Chase didn't like it? You can't have been surprised that I didn't.

Constrained? Yeah, a bit I guess. But like we said in the show, we've already had the Millar argument. TWICE. In the Ultimate episode and the Iron Man episode. And honestly, guys, I know some of you were waiting for a blow-up here, but neither one of us had anything new to add to the argument. Having the same fight over and over again just isn't any fun for us, and really, it's not that much fun to listen to for the third time either. So we tried to approach this differently. It may not have had the ferocity some of you expected, but hopefully, you enjoyed it anyway.

[Wolverace]

Originally Posted by Blake Petit

Be honest here -- were you just surprised Chase didn't like it? You can't have been surprised that I didn't.

Touché.

Originally Posted by Blake Petit

Constrained? Yeah, a bit I guess. But like we said in the show, we've already had the Millar argument. TWICE. In the Ultimate episode and the Iron Man episode. And honestly, guys, I know some of you were waiting for a blow-up here, but neither one of us had anything new to add to the argument. Having the same fight over and over again just isn't any fun for us, and really, it's not that much fun to listen to for the third time either. So we tried to approach this differently. It may not have had the ferocity some of you expected, but hopefully, you enjoyed it anyway.

I enjoyed it anyway. But I did miss the usual rant. BTW, isn't Millar pronounced MillAR instead of MIller? I'm not sure on this though.

And as much as I loved the Wanted trade, I think I'll pass the movie. The trailer make the movie seem so far removed from the original work. I believe his work has been raped to a degree usually reserved for Alan Moore movies.

[staredcraft]

Thanks for reading my e-mail LOL I'm a guy who sends A LOT of e-mails so get used to it

Also I'd LOVE to post a review on itunes but I have to have a credit card to join things and be able to post comments...so I can't...sorry

Well you can get all 6 of the Marvel Zombie-featured issues of UFF in the Marvel Zombies Dead Days Hardcover which collects them, the prequel, and the Black Panther crossover too

Also I KNOW the guy (Through AIM) who made the POwer Girl Fan Films...heck I wrote the script for his Jason (REd HooD) Trailer...but to correct chase he did NOT do she-hulk...he's done CATWOMAN but not She-hulk

[Chase Bouzigard]

Originally Posted by staredcraft

Thanks for reading my e-mail LOL I'm a guy who sends A LOT of e-mails so get used to it

Also I'd LOVE to post a review on itunes but I have to have a credit card to join things and be able to post comments...so I can't...sorry

Well you can get all 6 of the Marvel Zombie-featured issues of UFF in the Marvel Zombies Dead Days Hardcover which collects them, the prequel, and the Black Panther crossover too

Also I KNOW the guy (Through AIM) who made the POwer Girl Fan Films...heck I wrote the script for his Jason (REd HooD) Trailer...but to correct chase he did NOT do she-hulk...he's done CATWOMAN but not She-hulk

My bad dude, sorry when I found them on youtube, they were all posted by the same guy, never paid any mind to who made them. I love the power girl ones and the She-Hulk were in the same style sorry

[Zap Rowsdower]

Originally Posted by Blake Petit

And honestly, guys, I know some of you were waiting for a blow-up here, but neither one of us had anything new to add to the argument. Having the same fight over and over again just isn't any fun for us, and really, it's not that much fun to listen to for the third time either.

Thank you.

I've retired from this discussion. We go through 700 pages and at the end we all agree, "Millar writes good Millar stories."

Basically, if you like Millar, then you like Millar. It's not profound or particularly insightful, but it's the one thing we can all agree to.

[staredcraft]

Originally Posted by Chase Bouzigard

My bad dude, sorry when I found them on youtube, they were all posted by the same guy, never paid any mind to who made them. I love the power girl ones and the She-Hulk were in the same style sorry

Well just go here http://www.blinky-productions.com/ He's also the same guy who plays Blue Beetle in his films AND his films Catwoman...is his WIFE!

[Chase Bouzigard]

Originally Posted by staredcraft

Well just go here http://www.blinky-productions.com/ He's also the same guy who plays Blue Beetle in his films AND his films Catwoman...is his WIFE!

Thanks For the link I have spent most of the afternoon, watching these films. If he wants any time on the show just let us know we would love to have him.

[Ben Lehnsherr]

-- I understand you guys didn't want to go over the same old arguments, but you guys were restrained in this podcast to the point that you guys didn't even really seem like yourselves.

-- Good to see you reppin' 1985, Chase. The first issue was excellent.

-- Where was the Wanted podcast? It was covered for like 3 and half minutes.

-- They've finally collected the Aztek: The Ultimate Man in TPB? Off to the bookstore I shall go!

[Blake Petit]

Dude, there's absolutely no way to spend an hour talking about Wanted, even if we did rant. I'm kind of surprised we didn't talk about it longer either, but we came to a consensus rather quickly.

[Ben Lehnsherr]

Originally Posted by Blake Petit

Dude, there's absolutely no way to spend an hour talking about Wanted, even if we did rant. I'm kind of surprised we didn't talk about it longer either, but we came to a consensus rather quickly.

I know. Neither of you liked it, so there wasn't much to discuss. Just poking fun. I've missed a few podcasts, and this was the first one back. Expect more comments as I listen to the casts in reverse order.

[Ryan Broussard]

ooooookay....here we go


First Blake I think the fact that pretty much over 50% of what was discussed you have not read makes you seem a bit harsh on Millar.....SO there came a point where you decided not to read his stories because of a past story....Thats fine, but you as a writer should no that writers and artist can change and get better...

I am so sick of hearing shock value...what the hell is that guys....I mean I feel him and morrison are very similar except that Millar's stuff usually makes sense. I loved Morrison's X-Men , but come one, 90% of that was shock value? What the hell is Sea Guy, I liked that it is so wierd but if Millar would have wrote that he would have been stoned together because of how he is labeled....

I don't see how people can say one is shock value and the other is genius...You gonna tell me that killing Martian manhunter in one panel was not shock value?? come on

Frank Miller is just a Shock guy now if You want to label people....That is the miller that I feel got in his comfort zone and felt he could do anything and people would like it(although I think All star bats is getting better)

Millar's Ultimate X-Men was great and when I think about his return to Ultimate FF when he wasn't with bendis I always think that was in a movie, the time travel story and the zombies were both incredible stories, if he was still on ult FF, i would still be buying it..

Chase you were dead on about Red Son, really really great story, one of my favorite else world books....

Civil war= Ultimates??? I dont see it.....Besides if you as me civil war brought tony to a whole new level, never never before have I been so intrigued by his character....

Civil war also set up the cap death which i think brought that book to a new level as well...

As far as FF now goes, it is some what bad, but not for all the reasons you guys state, I mean what there have been 3-4 issues, and one panel with Dr. Doom...one panel chase....and because of that Millar got that character all wrong? I dont get it, same thing can be said for Franklin, how much page time has he had....i dont get it.

Also in terms of Johnny , the story aint over guys, we don't know this girls powers or anything really, she could have control powers or something that has yet to be revealed....if that isnt the case, then throw your stones, but at least let things play out.....

What is bad about FF is that terrible Robot fight and the awful art.

Ultimates is probably one of the best stories I have ever read...Hitch's art looked good there (not great , he is overrated) but much better than his FF. The story was flawless though....definitely Millar's best work to date, perfect book for him

Chase if you want to see JrJR do grimm, pick up the Gray Area...good dark book.

Wanted was a great book....I loved all the characters, which is why I do not know what I will think of the movie.....But i never though he changed over night Blake. He had to train and work hard to be a killer, it took some time to convince him at first but then he realized how terrible his life was and figured anything would have to be better....it worked for me

His wolverine is out, and I really loved it (as you can see in my review) I love when Millar is given an open field to play on and that is what he has here, it should be a great story

Kick -*** is a great story so far and has good Art Chase, I think you will enjoy it....but let me guess....the title ....that's "SHOCK VALUE" right? jeez

Overall, people are too hard on Millar, they love throwing crap his way and if he deserves it that is fine....Like for the FF robots.....to to say he is ALL shock value is a bit wrong, and to say his much older stuff is his best works is a bit biased I feel if you have not read all of his works...

Just my opinion.....but I really deeply feel that some people hate a book before they pick it up just because Millar's name is on it just because it is so easy to point the finger at him.......

I have only read one thing of his that I didnt think was good and that is the FF right now, I hope it gets better but I think thats a good record....although I read a summary of Trouble and that made me sick, so I that I dont get, but that doesnt mean I would give up on him as a writer.

I am not like Millar's #1 fan or anything , but I like the majority of his work and have read the majority of his work....

I just think Blake that in your mind right now Millar could only do wrong even if he did right......

just the way it comes across and always has when you talk about millar...

Overall good show though I enjoyed listening
peace

[Blake Petit]

No, Ryan, I didn't say I stopped reading Millar's stuff because of "one story." I stopped reading it because of a STRING of stories that made me feel the same way. And the stuff of his I've read since then (i.e. Civil War, Fantastic Four) makes me feel exactly the same way, and utterly justified in my decision.

How did this turn into a Millar vs. Morrison discussion? Morrison's writing has absolutely nothing to do with my feelings about Millar's work. Although if you'd caution me to reserve judgment about Johnny's story until Millar's FF is over, I'd suggest you do the same with J'onn J'onzz.

I agree with you on The Gray Area. Very good, underrated series. I'd like to see it come back.

[Ben Lehnsherr]

Well, look at Ryan. Way to get with it!

[Ryan Broussard]

Originally Posted by Blake Petit

No, Ryan, I didn't say I stopped reading Millar's stuff because of "one story." I stopped reading it because of a STRING of stories that made me feel the same way. And the stuff of his I've read since then (i.e. Civil War, Fantastic Four) makes me feel exactly the same way, and utterly justified in my decision.

How did this turn into a Millar vs. Morrison discussion? Morrison's writing has absolutely nothing to do with my feelings about Millar's work. Although if you'd caution me to reserve judgment about Johnny's story until Millar's FF is over, I'd suggest you do the same with J'onn J'onzz.

I agree with you on The Gray Area. Very good, underrated series. I'd like to see it come back.

I never said your judgment was based on one book Blake, let me make that clear.....

Its not Morrison versus Millar, but it is me trying to understand....so many people seem to see Morrison as so good...and I am one of them (We3 is incredible) but some of those people hate Millar simply for Shock value and I dont get how you can like one person for his shocking moments and not the other....

as far as the Johnny girlfriend and Manhunter issue , once again, I just dont understand.....people are "shocked by Johnny's actions and get in an uproar, yet they dont say a thing about Manhunter dying just because some one could kill him....I don't understand

and that is my point....where is the ruler? What makes shocking moments a moment of just mindless Shock Value rather than something profound.....

why is one accepted and the other not.....

my brain hurts....

[Blake Petit]

Here's my gauge, Ryan: I consider something being done for shock value if...

1) It goes outrageously against established logic or characterization without sufficient explanation and/or...
2) It serves no purpose in the overall plot except to inflame/upset/horrify the reader

The classic "Hulk horny" line is a perfect example. It served no purpose to the plot. It was only there to get a reaction. And it was stupid. (At this point, someone will break in and point out that this is merely my opinion. I freely admit this. It's always my opinion. That's the point.)

I'm not about to break down all the different examples again -- I've gone through them on the show plenty of times. But if Johnny's tryst with the supervillain turns out to be the result of mind control or something, I'll concede it's not just shock value. (That doesn't necessarily mean it'll be a good story, but it won't just be shock value.) However, based on the history of what I've read from the writer, I don't really expect that to happen. I consider it shock value, for now, because it defies logic and characterization. The issue with J'onn, however, does not defy logic or characterization. He was killed by fire, his long-established weakness. Like it or not, it's not in defiance of logic.

As for me not being able to say something is a writer's "best" or "worst" work because I haven't read it all... well, by that logic I could almost never use that phrase. I haven't read all of Kurt Busiek's work, but I have no trouble saying I think Astro City is his best. I haven't seen every Mel Brooks movie, but I think History of the World Part I is his best.

But if it helps, guys, just make this mental insertion: whenever I refer to something as being anyone's "best" or "worst," please just assume that the pool to which I am referring consists only of those works that I, personally, have read. Otherwise we'll have to put a disclaimer on every episode.

[Wolverace]

Originally Posted by Zap Rowsdower

Thank you.

I've retired from this discussion. We go through 700 pages and at the end we all agree, "Millar writes good Millar stories."

Basically, if you like Millar, then you like Millar. It's not profound or particularly insightful, but it's the one thing we can all agree to.

Since when did you become so sensible? Are you writing this for shockvalue?

Originally Posted by Ryan Broussard

ooooookay....here we go

I just think Blake that in your mind right now Millar could only do wrong even if he did right......

just the way it comes across and always has when you talk about millar...

Preach on, brother, preach on.
You have brought a tear to my eye.

[Chase Bouzigard]

Ryan, First I am looking forward to Kick ***, all ready pre-ordered the hardcover.

Morrison is not above Shock. F. Crisis and the Manhunter, That will be a whole show in not to long.

F.F. Sorry but dude,it is just bad. I just do not like it.

I also think we were not clear about Civil War, I loved it and what it did for both cap and Iron Man. I just think that it felt like he was writing them from the Ult. books. And the story would have been great as Ultimits 3